Sorry if this is not the proper community for this question. Please let me know if I should post this question elsewhere.
So like, I’m not trying to be hyperbolic or jump on some conspiracy theory crap, but this seems like very troubling news to me. My entire life, I’ve been under the impression that no one is technically/officially above the law in the US, especially the president. I thought that was a hard consensus among Americans regardless of party. Now, SCOTUS just made the POTUS immune to criminal liability.
The president can personally violate any law without legal consequences. They also already have the ability to pardon anyone else for federal violations. The POTUS can literally threaten anyone now. They can assassinate anyone. They can order anyone to assassinate anyone, then pardon them. It may even grant complete immunity from state laws because if anyone tries to hold the POTUS accountable, then they can be assassinated too. This is some Putin-level dictator stuff.
I feel like this is unbelievable and acknowledge that I may be wayyy off. Am I misunderstanding something?? Do I need to calm down?
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Forget amendments, this is gonna take a whole new document.
Isn’t that part of the plan for the GOP’s Project 2025?
If you aren’t GQP-brainwashed, you are concerned.
Only positive thing that could theoretically come out of this, for me as a European, is that some US representatives will finally stop going around saying that you are the greatest democracy on this planet. Problem is, the US nationals who usually utter such BS are not the ones able to realize how anti-democratic this is. As a US citizen with a working brain, I would be in DC now.
This is the worst you got to, up to now, going full circle from colony of a monarchy to monarchy.
It is time to distance ourselves until you get your shit together.
I’m pissed that Biden isn’t calling their bluff and breaking a ton of laws right now.
Yes, have you browsed Lemmy or the general internet the past few days??? How can you still be asking “is anyone else” at this point?
Because they want to make a successful post but don’t actually have anything to add to the conversation.
I don’t get why that would “make a successful post” it’s weird.
And yet here we are.
If my presence is the measure of success we’re using, we’re in way bigger trouble than I had imagined.
I an not even American and even I am pissed at that dumb ruling.
And what is even more annoying is that I read that what is considered an official act is not clear, so a court will need to decide if an act was official or not, and that court will be the SCOTUS.
So they could easily decide that acts Biden performed was not official, but the same acts performed by Trump was official, and invent some crap about context being different in som complex way, so with this ruling they have moved the power from the POTUS to the SCOTUS while POTUS stays the fall guy.
I get the feeling that what Trump did to earn his felonies isn’t exactly covered. Mainly because there is no way that could be considered an official act
Didnt they just say, that it was an official act?
I believe they did.
Do it. Do it now. You know what kind of person lived a life knowing they made the right decision?
Everyone that left Germany in 1932.
Let’s say the best possible thing happens. Biden crushes Trump, the Republicans lose so many seats Team Not Fascists can push through Constitutional Amendments.
What would Democrats actually change for the better?
Do you think that is likely?
Or will you be spending the rest of your life wondering if this is the election year that starts a civil war in one of the the most militarised nations on the planet? Do you want to be in a major nuclear power where one side specifically hates cities when it has a civil war?
Even if things go relatively well, this bullshit isn’t ending without one. As a best outcome! The other is no one even doing that! Every two fucking years you’re going to be watching which Congressional seats fall to fascism because one team has just chosen to abandon reality and democracy.
What would Democrats actually change for the better?
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See Canada
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See Norway
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Do like them.
That’s about 20 years of reform.
- GO TO 1
You’re right that they could.
Now look at their past legislation. Will they?
The democrats are not even left enough to be a centrist party in Canada. They will not reform.
While you might be generally correct, some of the legislation passed during Biden’s term is genuinely better than what even Europe could come up with.
More likely they’ll have a party and slap each other on the back for not needing to court the union vote anymore.
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Just know that you’re not the only one that sees it this way. There are a lot of us, but not nearly enough.
It sincerely feel absolutely insane. Completely beyond any party line bullshit - I’m almost as concerned with what Obama would do with this as what Trump would do with this.
This sort of ruling has no place in a democratic society. It is beyond reprehensible, it is utterly absurd.
The fact that it has been basically accepted by the general public - no riots, no large-scale outcry - sends a dire fucking message.
“May you live in interesting times”, indeed.
The riots are coming.
Yes, that’s why Republicans will do absolutely nothing about guns. They want the sister fucking inbreeds armed wihen they say “Go.”
Democrats don’t like riots, if leftists protest too hard liberals are the first to tell them they’re hurting the cause.
You must simply VOTE BLUE NO MATTER WHO!!! every few years, that’s the extent of political action requested and allowed by liberals
Don’t forget, when voting fails and the candidate loses, it’s the left’s ( and young people’s) fault, not the candidate.
Pretty sure we all are at least a little ticked off about it. Except for maybe all the fat oranges magats out there
The president can personally violate any law without legal consequences.
This isn’t true.
They ruled that the President has criminal immunity for official acts in line with the constitutional rights and duties of the POTUS.
They also ruled that non-official acts, or acts taken in a personal capacity as a private citizen, are not immune to criminal prosecution, and that there’s a large gray area in between the two where it needs to be decided on a case-by-case basis.
And as I understand it, they SCOTUS get to decide what counts as official. So theoretically, they could decide, for example, that killing a political opponent is official. After all someone who disagrees might effect the smooth running of the government. And so on.
Technically its the lower court but you know they will all be appealed and ultimately the supreme court will decide.
i know this is a dumb question, but why isn’t there some kind of law mandating equal amounts of SC Justices from each party? that way, they would HAVE to work together and one side can’t take control. i thought this country was sooo proud of our checks and balances, but it seems to me that they aren’t working.
The SC judges are supposed to be non-partisan. The idea was that life terms would insulate them from partisan pressures. This has never really been the case. As far back as 1857, the Dred Scott decision was largely viewed as influenced by partisan politics. You can look to the tensions between Roosevelt and the court for more stark evidence of the political nature of the Supreme Court.
Changing this would require a constitutional amendment, which seems unlikely in the near future given the present state of affairs.
thank you for the informative reply. i was unfortunately homeschooled with very white washed Southern Baptist curriculum so i am still learning basics about how our government ACTUALLY works. and the more i learn, the more i hate it here.
it seems so obvious to me that life terms themselves are extremely prone to corruption, especially in a capitalist society. isn’t this the whole reason Washington refused a third term? it is very interesting, albeit terrifying, to see the same principal held for certain parts of government, but not for others, with no discernable way to fix it at this point.
I’m happy I could help. My sympathies for having to make up later in life an education you were rightly owed. I’m from the south myself and know more than a few people who experienced the same. Fortunately it’s never to late to learn and what better time than an election year?
If you’re interested Scott Abernathy’s “American Government: Stories of a Nation” is a great and comprehensive overview of the structure and function of the US government. It provides a fairly balanced view and a narrative style that is easier to digest than more textbook-like sources.
Our country is indeed in trouble and while I won’t say fixing it will be easy, I urge you not to give in to doomerism. Stay informed, be critical, and most of all, find some way to get involved, if you can, at the local level.
i will look for that to listen to at work. it sounds helpful. I’m definitely not giving in, but it is very scary being queer in America right now. I’m hopeful for the best but preparing for the worst.
It’s yet another tactic to delay.
Or the CIA. We all know how trigger happy they are after all.
They left it intentionally vague so cases will make it to the supreme Court so the court can decide based on of the president is on their team or not.
They also said that official acts cover just about everything when using presidential power, and you can’t take motive into account when determining if it’s an official act or not. Shooting a gun at someone himself. Not official sure. Ordering someone in the military to do it. You can’t ask why he did it, and if it was legal, why would immunity matter?
I am not important enough to be targeted but privileged enough to be noticed if I was disappeared.
I wonder who killed JFK. Yeah it was Bush Senior and his ilk. Those responsible for the business (biznuss) plot by fascist scum in the 30s to coup d’etat the American government then. If it was not for Smedley Butler being the person they tried to get to lead this failed coup, and him going to congress instead to lead their army of hundreds of thousands… history would be VERY different.
This link is a link to one of Americas greatest heroes, in my opinion. I hope he rests in peace.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smedley_Butler
This link has a picture of the most ruthless killers in history all together cozy as a family, being two faced little biatches & fleecing the American people with wedge issue politics where people morally feel they need to choose a side (abortion, gun control, social issues like LGBTQ rights etc), instead of the American people uh, focusing on the economic side of things . https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/04/the-story-of-the-viral-photo-of-the-presidential-families.html
To be fair, the president can and does already assassinate people extrajudicially.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_assassinations_by_the_United_States
How often has a politician said they should be able to assassinate their political rivals?
“The idea was put forward by the former president’s lawyers earlier this week” (Jan. 2024)
I mean yeah. We all knew Robert’s wasn’t going to encourage Biden to prosecute Bush and Obama for drone strikes.
Doesn’t make it not a war crime.
Biden has no balls. He should take one for the team and order the execution of SCOTUS. Either he gets prosecuted or he’ll put an end to this nonsense by force. Even if he gets prosecuted he’s old as fuck he’ll never see prison.
Just throw the six that voted for immunity in prison for treason. A fate worse than death
Easily proved. Especially if you bring it in front of what’s left of SCOTUS.
But then Biden is a dictator too. It’s fun to dream about revenge but it always hurts the wrong people in the end.
At this point, we need someone to seize the reins long enough to save us. And then put them down.
History says it never, ever, works like that.
It tells of many examples of when people thought it was a good idea…
Roman dictators did exactly that, though
Not saying their system was perfect by any means but people out here acting like there’s 0 historic examples are just wrong
Yeah, that’s a perfect example of how awful things can get. A slave driven economy … and society full off ancient bullshit and death and strife and murder and horrific genocides… if you’re holding up the Roman empire as a good thing for people…well, I’m not going to convince you of much.
They’ve had great marketing since though… Especially the holy Catholic Church who has just the BEST history of being so great, like I think Epstein’s greatest blunder was not being a Catholic. They would have protected him much better.
Wow, what awful reading comprehension you have.
Did I not literally say they weren’t perfect?
Did I claim their society was perfect and the result of dictators?
Or did I refute the idea that history exclusively shows dictators abusing their power?
Careful, this is the exact mantra of the right. They just want a little dictatorship to get things back in line and then things will go back to normal.
SPOILER: it won’t
Isn’t that the exact story of The Phantom Menace?
Just the once though. Then balance/expand the SCOTUS. Give the Republicans a few to make it fair. Vote to overturn, and forget it ever happened. Logical people can’t get that upset that the only thing he did with his new king powers is do what it takes to save democracy
I think not using the power is the only right thing to do. Power corrupts the user. That’s why the balance of power existed. Using it now invites a future where it’s used again. We were very lucky to not slip down the slope of using nukes “just a little”. We wouldn’t be here to talk about if it had.
Enjoy your King, fellow subjects.