I need a new car, and I really want to go full electric. I’m wondering if anyone regrets buying one? What are the downsides?
I had one and severely miss it. Well, I don’t miss the one I had but I miss the EV part of it.
I had a 2015 BMW i5 which apparently that and the 2014 models had a whole host of problems, especially if you were like me and had the range extender which was basically a small motorcycle gas engine seated in the back and could be used to charge the battery. Being BMW’s first generations, it’s not too much of a surprise that they’d have issues but there was more beyond those like the small form tires that didn’t last long, were rare, and expensive and the 12v battery which was also expensive, rare, and difficult to replace…
Beyond all that, I just miss the simplicity and the feel of the EV drive. Stepping on the accelerator and you feel it accelerate. It has much lower maintenance, with the only trade off being that tires usually don’t last as long as an ICE because the battery adds so much more weight and the battery replacement can be pricey. But other than that, no oil changes, no transmission worries, no smog checks, no needing to let the car warm up…just hop in and go. I also miss the charging aspect of it. Sure, it sucked not having the same range as a gas/hybrid where I now get about 500 miles on a full tank, but I actually liked going to charging stations and just sitting there while my car charged. I also liked the price difference, so much cheaper. I also liked that I could be lazy. I didn’t have to “fill up” when I was tired on my way home or early the next morning because I would charge at home and have a full “tank” to use the next day.
I only got rid of the i5 because of the host of problems and got a hybrid instead which has been fine and a better car in many ways, but I still long to go back. I’ve been thinking very strongly about going and trading in for an EV each weekend that passes by. I’ve been researching possible EVs to go to and have a few in mind I’d like to check out now that the prices are way down.
See how you feel about it after watching this: Aging Wheels/Technology Connections EV Road Trip
God damn this thread is depressing. We need a carbon tax yesterday.
Last time I had to buy a new car was 2022.
Based on my driving habits and needs total cost per km driven was 3 times as high for electric.
Most of it being purchase price of the car. There were no used electric cars that has the winter time range so I had to compare a used gas vs new top of the line electric.
The big question is if you can charge at home. Depending on the car, it’s feasible to do so on a normal outlet if you drive ~30 miles or less per day. A 240 volt outlet can be a game changer on top of that though. My setup charges my car 0-100 in about 6 hours (you know, overnight, when I’m not doing anything and electricity is cheapest). But if I were in an apartment and had no access to overnight charging I’d consider other options.
(Chevy Bolt EUV)
Not at all. Matter of fact I went and bought a second one a year later
I have not regretted it. Bought a second EV for my family as well. Most of my extended family have also bought EVs and all had positive experiences. I don’t know anyone who has regretted it.
I haven’t regretted it. Did a road trip across the country. Takes more planning because chargers are more sparse than gas stations, but totally doable. Having a place to charge is a must. I lived in an apartment complex without charging and REALLY had to plan my charging sessions or it could get stuck in the parking garage.
Yeah, I stayed with my parents for a few months while I was house hunting and being limited to Level 1 charging was challenging. I couldn’t recover a full commute’s worth of charge overnight and would start each day with progressively less charge, so I’d have to swing by a L3 charger once a week or so. Still cheaper than gas though.
Father in law got one. Loved it until he had some sort of issue and needed to get it repaired. His old Honda Accord he could take down the block to any old mechanic but it was harder with Tesla. I think it soured him on it and he eventually ditched the EC when he moved out of the city
I think mainly the problem there is Tesla. They’re a closed ecosystem.
We’ve had three EVs for a few years now and they been great, had four in total and replaced the first one a bit over a year ago as its lease expired, so no regrets.
Lengthy road trips aren’t a problem if you plan out your route in advance I get not everyone wants to do this so if this you then wait till there are more charging stations for your region. We plan stops based on charging stations that have a lot of high speed chargers (over 100kw) so we are never waiting more than 20 minutes and never waiting for a charger. It is faster to charge twice to around 80% on one of these than it is to charge to 100% once due to how much charging slows down as the battery nears completion. I would not even consider a car that does not have a 800v architecture due to the slower charging speeds if you plan on road trips.
We have done 1200 mile round trips, probably small fry for Americans but a lot for us, especially as we towing for all that. Its achievable with planning in most western countries. I want to stop at most every three hours as I want to use the loo, are people who are driving 6 more hours non stop peeing in a bottle or something?
Cost per mile is stupidly low as we charge at home when not on trips over 280 miles, 8p per kwh, with a monthly cost between the three cars of £40 for around 2000 miles a month (more in summer, about that in winter). Good luck doing 2000 miles on £40 for an ICE car. Charging when out is more expensive the faster you want to charge, ultra rapids work out about the same per mile as high economy petrol ICE, rapids or lower a bit cheaper but nothing significant. Its only going to be cheaper if you can charge at home and your energy provider has a suitable EV tariff as we do.
Absolutely zero chance I would buy an EV right now as depreciation is already horrendous and the rate of change for EVs is rapid unless you know the car will meet your log term needs and those will not change. We lease so that all the cost of the risk is with the leasing company and we know we want the improvements.
Edit: Plug in hybrids are fucking useless BTW, you are either doing a ton of miles and using the ICE all the time, or you are using the battery all the time and very rarely the ICE. It means carrying around both a full EV setup and a full ICE setup, so you have more than twice the complexity of either and more weight than an actual pure EV with the same battery that impacts both EV and ICE economy. Plus recent studies have shown that hybrids are far harder on the ICE part than a pure ICE, which is fucking awful for long term ownership.
They were only ever meant as a stop gap until battery prices dropped, which they have and its now possible to get EVs with over 400 miles of ACTUAL range not just promised range.
Seven hours is about my limit without stopping to piss. My work vehicle, which I make the vast majority of my long trips in, gets 500 miles to the tank so it’s not the limiting factor. I was reading higher up that some people fill up their car when it gets to half full? Wtf? I’ll start looking for a good place for gas when it’s 50 miles to empty.
are people who are driving 6 more hours non stop peeing in a bottle or something?
They are stopping every 3 hours for gas, but they have a “when the pump stops better be in the car” rule. Generally two drivers, one goes in, pees, and returns to watch the pump so the second can go in and pee. If you are young and fast is possible for two people to pee in the time it takes to fill your tank with gas. (males typically take half as much time as females)
Every 3 hours?
New gas engines can drive for up to at least 8 hours depending on ascent and load without feuling up again. Theyve been getting really good at economizing. Just stop to go pee, stretch legs, take a nap.
they compensate for better economy with smaller tanks in the cars I’ve seen. Though I’ll admit to not knowing all tanks.
For health and safety reasons you should stop, stretch your legs, and take a nap. Unfortunately I know far too many people who are not doing that. Normally they get by with it, but there are many many road deaths every year because of things people normally get by with.
Not yet, but are there any electric cars that aren’t spyware with touchscreens on wheels?
I would argue all connected cars have become that. If you’re buying anything newer than 2015, in all likelihood it’s a spyware filled go-kart.
lol. As opposed to the 6 inch rectangle in your pocket
I’m driving a 2007 which I guess I’ll move on from in a couple of years. I loathe the day when my only options are cars that get OTA updates.
Everything smart has shown their true colours about altering the deal. My TV didn’t use to have ads on the home screen. Now it’s 80% of it.
Downsides are you can’t drive as far, usually, before needing to fill up, and quick charge takes about 25 minutes, instead of the usual 5 for gas.
Upside is that only matters on road trips. If you have an outlet at home, like we do, your car is just always charged.
Yeah it seems only practical if a person is travelling local and is assured outlets are where they are going. Road trips you are never assured there is a station especially if you’re seeing relatives.
That’s not what I said at all.
Charging stations are pretty plentiful. Basically if there’s a gas station, there’s probably also a charging station nearby.
None of my relatives have a charging station.
If they have electricity, you can charge there. Portable chargers are a thing.
But, I wasn’t talking about a charging station in their house. I’d assume they also don’t have a gas station in their house. I’m talking about a public fast charging station. Something like Electrify America, ChargePoint, or Tesla Supercharger.
I don’t think you’re here to discuss, just to lick your own bum on what works for you explicitly.
Me and the millions of other people who own electric cars. What value have you added to this conversation? Do you even own an electric car? It sounds like you’re not talking from experience.
I can talk from experience as a car owner and as someone who should be interested enough to know if it’s viable enough for me.im allowed an opinion. My feedback for my needs is valid. Deal with it or cry more.
Yes, I ended up selling and buying a hybrid. Super happy with the hybrid.
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Basically instant “recharge” speed.
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Longer range.
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More vehicle options.
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Don’t have to worry about heat or cold draining my fuel.
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Can leave the car stationary for long periods of time without the fuel draining.
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More fueling stations.
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More reliable fueling stations (chargers may be broken.)
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Less software bullshit. (Tesla)
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Less possibly breaking updates. (Tesla) No joke. My car’s software literally crashed on the freeway once and I was essentially driving blind because all the screens went blank.
I drive a lot and for long distances. Switching to hybrid made trips shorter by an hour.
And I still got to keep fancy drive assist features. It’s like 80% of autopilot, if not more.
Oh! And big one! Even though an electric car may say something like 500km range! That’s NOT the usable range! You’re not going to be driving the car to 0km. You’re not even supposed to charge to 100% most of the time! So most of the time you’ll charge to 80%, that’s 400km in the battery. But, you probably wanna play it safe, so you’ll want to recharge with 50km to 100km left in the battery. Leaving you with about 300km of usable range.
Then the heat, cold, and time will slowly drain your 300km…
Meanwhile, my hybrid has about 700km of usable range, regardless of time and weather.
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Other than the fact that I overspent a bit, I don’t regret it. Especially since I live in Florida and didn’t have to deal with the gas shortages due to the hurricanes. As long as you have a reliable means of charging at home (or at work), you are good 95% of the time.
If you do any regular long-range driving, be sure you get one that can support that distance. Public EV chargers can still be hit-or-miss, and that’s the biggest downside in my opinion. They aren’t too frequent, and a lot of times they just don’t work. You also generally need to get an account for each charging network, or else it can be hard to pay or you just pay more. But I can live with that, because it is very much an exceptional part of my driving habits.
I’m also considering getting a full electric car, but have a little range anxiety mixed with a general feeling that the improvements over the next couple years will make current electric cars obsolete, so I am following along with this thread!
Personally the newer vehicles have been going more and more into drm on all their things. Even ICE vehicles have been doing it. Locking the consumer into their walled garden parts and service. And when they erroneously decide that your car doesn’t make enough profit, they tell you too bad, your 3yr old car isn’t supported, you should buy a new one.
Battery technology itself isn’t going to have a huge breakthrough reach the electric vehicle consumer in the next 5 years. They’d already have to have viable proof of concept to do that, and nobody has.
ICE engines improve all the time too. Are you similarly hesitant to buy a car with one?
Sort of. ICE engines are much more mature, and the improvements happen in much smaller increments. There were plenty of ICE cars 30 years that could get 30 mpg, just like there are today. Whereas with EVs, we’re talking about potentially extending range and charging speeds by 50% or more.
EVs are older than ICE cars.
The market definitely went ICE for decades, but how mature is mature enough for you?
EVs are older, sure, but they were in suspended animation for a long time.
As to the question of how mature is mature enough, that depends. In my case, as an EV owner, I think they are mature enough now. However, the fact that major developments in range, efficiency, charging speed, etc are happening regularly in the EV space reflects a certain immaturity. The technology clearly has not yet stabilized, and that may be concerning for people coming from an ICE background.
It’s definitely a different line for everyone, which is why I asked them to self-evaluate to challenge their own thoughts about it.
It could be they’re ready when a standard battery is 300+ miles with a half hour charge up. Could be 500+ with 10 minutes to charge, etc. until we get to a place where it’s probably far outside our lifetime and it’s suddenly a hard no to EVs and they may have had no idea.
I just chafe a bit at vague “not yet” with no clear goal. It’s the bread and butter of bad faith arguments against EVs and I don’t like to see it spread, intentionally or not.
That seems like it would only be a concern for people that need the new thing all the time, which is an expansive proposition when it comes to cars.
As long as the batteries and drivetrain hold up, the people looking to spend 10-20k on their commuter rather than 40-70k will accept things that are out of date.
Look for a used one now. The prices are low enough that you’ll be able to get a good one for a low enough price that you may not feel bad if you decide to upgrade in 2 or 3 years.
improvements over the next couple years will make current electric cars obsolete
This is my problem with any new car. Practically every new car (even ICEVs) is just a smart phone on wheels now. It’s not like in the ‘90s - ‘00s when you could still legit buy a car from the ‘70s and daily drive it and repair it in your own drive way for cheap (most people in the 50s - 80s were capable of basic tune ups, etc).
My concern is that at some point the parts won’t be made anymore. Or if the LCD command console gets cracked or something your car’s totaled. I mean, people used to own cars for at least ten years, twenty years wasn’t uncommon. Do you think a 2025 XYZ is going to be on the road in ten years- twenty years? What’s the resale value on that / who’s going to buy a twenty year old phone on wheels?
As much as people believe EVs are better for the environment, aren’t they increasing the rate at which a vehicle ends up in landfill? I hope recycling is part of the car’s lifecycle.
At the same time though, I have to acknowledge that, without an ICE, EVs have far fewer points of failure. There’s a potential for them to be on the road much longer. I just don’t see that happening due to consumer demand. Even if you’re able to update the software and swap out worn out parts, is that enough to keep the car on the road as long as or longer than an ICEV? What happens when technology changes and they find better batteries or charging methods? How much do you have to invest in the phone on wheels to keep it on the road?
As much as people believe EVs are better for the environment, aren’t they increasing the rate at which a vehicle ends up in landfill? I hope recycling is part of the car’s lifecycle.
EOL has been part of the calculations I’ve seen. No car is better than an EV, but that is limiting.
A modern car is far more reliable than anything from the 1970s or before. Sure you could repair those older cars, but also you had to repair those older cars. I’m old enough to remember people bragging about getting 100k miles on a car - they had to check the oil every day, and most days add more. Today a ICE will go 300k miles with minimal maintenance, checking oil is not a common thing for people to do.
I’m not arguing that. My argument is actually because cars are far more reliable, doesn’t that decrease their resale value as more and more modern convinces are added to newer cars?
You’ve got a window of less than ten years on a modern car where then the technology in it is so old that few people would consider purchasing it to keep it for another five - ten years.
For example, my mom just bought a '24 Subaru with a huge touch screen in it. Will it keep working in ten years? Probably. Will anyone want to buy that phone on wheels in ten years? Not likely. I just bought a 2013 Mini Cooper. It “has bluetooth” but it’s strictly for (shitty sounding) phone calls and not audio streaming. I’m one of few people who’s okay with this because I’ll only drive 1500 miles a year.
Whereas a 25 year old car in 1998 was, aside from your accurate claim about reliability, perfectly fine as a daily driver. If you can find one and are capable of proper maintenance, you could still drive a 1960s car today. But because modern consumer tastes expect advancements in vehicles the same as they expect them in phones, I just don’t see used cars living as long as older cars have.
So, it’s not so much about the ability for a vehicle to remain on the road but consumer choice.
This is my problem with any new car. Practically every new car (even ICEVs) is just a smart phone on wheels now. It’s not like in the ‘90s - ‘00s when you could still legit buy a car from the ‘70s and daily drive it and repair it in your own drive way for cheap (most people in the 50s - 80s were capable of basic tune ups, etc).
Remember cars from the 70s and 80s were considered “clunkers” at 100k miles. Today that number is 200k miles generally.
My concern is that at some point the parts won’t be made anymore. Or if the LCD command console gets cracked or something your car’s totaled.
Thats true of all modern cars, not just EVs. That ICE car is full of computers named things like “Engine Control Module” etc. Its already happening where they are dying and a car is essentially totaled.
I mean, people used to own cars for at least ten years, twenty years wasn’t uncommon.
Twenty years wasn’t uncommon? For collectors cars or sunday drivers maybe. There were extraordinarily few 20 year old Plymonth Reliants on the roads in 2001.
Do you think a 2025 XYZ is going to be on the road in ten years- twenty years? What’s the resale value on that / who’s going to buy a twenty year old phone on wheels?
Even though there were other EVs before it, the Tesla Model S was the first mainstream EV that most would consider. You don’t have to wonder if they’re on the road. You can do used car searches for 2013 (11 years old!) and find them for sale.
As much as people believe EVs are better for the environment, aren’t they increasing the rate at which a vehicle ends up in landfill?
No. Interestingly one of the challenges of setting up recycling facilities for EV batteries that there simply aren’t enough EVs being taken off the road with their batteries junked to create enough feedstock to justify the facilities.
If anything, the cut corners and non-reparibilty of the many common ICE vehicles is generating far larger waste. Try to buy a rebuilt Hyundai Sonata ICE engine for a car built in the last 10 years. You will have a hard time because they aren’t very servicable and they break often. Lack of replacement engines means many cars that look amazing are headed to the scrapper because there’s no way to put them back on the road again.
At the same time though, I have to acknowledge that, without an ICE, EVs have far fewer points of failure. There’s a potential for them to be on the road much longer. I just don’t see that happening due to consumer demand.
“Electric cars accounted for around 18% of all cars sold in 2023, up from 14% in 2022 and only 2% 5 years earlier, in 2018.” source
Nearly 1 in every 5 new cars sold last year were EVs.
Gasoline consumption for vehicles is down 4.4% due to those drivers now driving EVs and not buying gasoline anymore source
Demand of EVs seems to be pretty decent.
People also just drive a lot more today than 40 years ago, in part, because jobs and shopping are further away (it’s gone down since COVID due to more WFH). A car with 100K miles on it was an old car. Now it’s not unheard of for people to put that kind of mileage on their car in under five years. I have no argument that vehicles are much more well built today.
As I said in another comment, I’m not arguing that cars are more capable of being on the road, just that I don’t believe people are going to choose to drive a ten to twenty year old car in 2035 - 2045 as much as they had fifty years prior. You could put less than $1,000 into a 100k mile car in the 90s and expect to get another 50k+ out of it. At least, I can confirm that that’s what I did with my 1976 Ford Elite and later my 1980 Camaro.
Moreover, there’s nothing aside from the maintenance of the vehicle and maybe improved gas mileage that would deter anyone from choosing to drive an older vehicle. There are far more reasons today to not choose a ten year old car than there were 30-40 years ago.
My point is about consumer choice and the advancements of technology. Will people choose to drive vehicles that aren’t compatible with future technology.
People also just drive a lot more today than 40 years ago, in part, because jobs and shopping are further away (it’s gone down since COVID due to more WFH). A car with 100K miles on it was an old car. Now it’s not unheard of for people to put that kind of mileage on their car in under five years. I have no argument that vehicles are much more well built today.
Well built for specific uses, but not necessarily well built to ensure lots of them are on the roads decades after their release.
As I said in another comment, I’m not arguing that cars are more capable of being on the road, just that I don’t believe people are going to choose to drive a ten to twenty year old car in 2035 - 2045 as much as they had fifty years prior.
I partially agree with but for different reasons that you’re stating.
You could put less than $1,000 into a 100k mile car in the 90s and expect to get another 50k+ out of it. At least, I can confirm that that’s what I did with my 1976 Ford Elite and later my 1980 Camaro.
That 1980 Camaro was a far simpler car that modern cars. Simple generally means more repairable, but that comes at other costs. Economics have shifted this behavior in western society. In 1980 labor was cheap and simple machines meant lower skilled workers could accomplish the work too. Meaning when your 1980s Camaro was slipping out of gear it made sense to take your Camero to a transmission shop (do those even still exist now?) and have them do a full teardown of your transmission and get the synchros replaced. Today it is almost unheard of to get transmission work done and instead your Auto Technician will simply replace the entire transmission if any problem is occurring inside with a synchro.
Further, that Auto Tech will also be part Electronic Technician with knowledge of hydraulics, air emissions, HVAC, and more. That makes for a much more expensive labor per hour charge.
Moreover, there’s nothing aside from the maintenance of the vehicle and maybe improved gas mileage that would deter anyone from choosing to drive an older vehicle. There are far more reasons today to not choose a ten year old car than there were 30-40 years ago.
Passenger safety and crash survivability has improved dramatically from cars 30-40 years old.
Automotive emissions were in their infancy 40 years ago, which is a partial cause for the climate change we live with today.
My point is about consumer choice and the advancements of technology. Will people choose to drive vehicles that aren’t compatible with future technology.
I’ve driven old cars. Things start to break that don’t break on even moderately old cars. Rubber seals on all kinds of things deteriorate. Rust claims the structural integrity. Long mechanical wear has you doing repair after repair always bracing for the next expensive thing. Its no panacea .
