• Iced Raktajino@startrek.website
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    6 hours ago

    Constantly. Usually it takes the form of reducing topics to binary choices and/or purity tests.

    • “You’re either with me or against me / You’re either part of the solution or part of the problem”
      • Where “part of the solution” means doing exactly, and only exactly what they think you should be doing.
    • “If you don’t satisfy all of my impossible requirements, you’re as bad as a nazi”
    • “We only agree on 99 out of 100 things, so clearly you’re not to be trusted”
    • etc
    • Gold_E_Lox@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      6 hours ago

      i really have never encountered someone like this.

      unless the ‘purity test’ is being anti genocide or pro trans rights. you know, basic fundamental shit.

      • jerakor@startrek.website
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        6 hours ago

        Genocide is a term that is both over and under used. There are currently about six genocides ongoing. I don’t see the point in trying to call someone out on it because no one is actually doing anything for or against it outside of a very small number of people.

        If someone asks me if I’m anti genocide I assume they mean something they specifically consider a genocide and they are trying to use this as bait to get me to out myself in some way. They don’t actually expect I’m personally participating or countering it in any way.

        Trans rights also is a loaded term now because there are a LOT of individual rights Trans people are needing to fight for all in parallel. It’s better to be specific.

        Sure someone who says they are against trans people is awful, but I find folks set the bar in different places and use that to start an argument. The easiest example is, what age should someone be allowed to transition which is an intensely challenging question to answer even on a medical level.

        • powerstruggle@sh.itjust.works
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          5 hours ago

          Yeah, the comment above is kind of a hilarious example of cognitive dissonance. “I’ve never seen purity tests, other than these tests for ensuring purity”. Blanket statements like that are rarely used in good faith.

            • powerstruggle@sh.itjust.works
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              4 hours ago

              There’s no assumption. They literally listed two purity tests that they themselves use, directly after saying that they never see anyone use purity tests

              • MotoAsh@piefed.social
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                3 hours ago

                Their purity test: You must not deny genocide.

                What you heard their purity test was: They must accept that any and all genocides that I think exist are real and a big problem.

                Again, you fucking morons are inferring things that aren’t there just to try and be witty, while utterly missing the point…

                Congratulations on failing your reading comprehension test.

                • jerakor@startrek.website
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                  39 minutes ago

                  You’ve got a bunch of nutjobs that will turn that phrasing into a white genocide conversation is the problem.

                  The second part of that is that genocide is a subjective term due to classification of ethnic groups being subjective.

                  Honestly this well encapsulates the problem I tend to have aligning on goals with other progressives and some liberals. Every time folks try to simplify something as complex as genocide down to a yes or no question it means they are already invalidating the majority of positions and forcing a conversation of agree with me or call me wrong. That isn’t how it works, that isn’t how discussion and debate work. Forcing people into Yes/No thinking doesn’t lead to progress, asking for people to think critically does.

        • snooggums@piefed.world
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          4 hours ago

          The easiest example is, what age should someone be allowed to transition which is an intensely challenging question to answer even on a medical level.

          That actually has a really simple answer, the right age is the one that the person and their doctors/medical professionals consider age appropriate for that individual. It isn’t up to society to restrict that decision. That is before the fact that medical professionals with direct experience with the person will have the best opinions on the topic.

          This is also true for every single medical decision. Also true for every decision that doesn’t directly harm someone else.

          • jerakor@startrek.website
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            3 hours ago

            I can’t imagine thinking any medical procedure has a simple answer, especially anything that permanently alters you.

            Medical professionals are people, sometimes they make the right choice, sometimes the wrong choice. There are people who shop for the wrong answer, and also people who get the wrong answer and live in suffering. It is important to question things and have a discourse.

            If my 16 year old came to me and asked to have their hearing removed as a solution to their mispohonia and that their therapist agrees and they found a surgeon… I don’t think I could just jump on board with that call.

            • snooggums@piefed.world
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              2 hours ago

              The simple answer is that it is nobody’s business but the patient and the medical professionals.

              A surgeon would not remove someone’s hearing for misophonia. They took an oath to do no harm and the vast, vast majority of medical professionals take that seriously on a personal level before getting into licensing and other requirements to practice.

              • jerakor@startrek.website
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                50 minutes ago

                The reasonable debate is at what age is that allowed. I do not think that has an easy answer other than legal age of majority for the country you are a citizen of. I think that the problem is there are harder answers than that worth seriously considering.

                • snooggums@piefed.world
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                  27 minutes ago

                  This is like saying there needs to be a minimum age for ADHD medications or birth control. Doctors are not giving minors sex changes all willy nilly and the procedures that they do provide like hormone suppression are proven safe, effective, and reversible.

                  Why does the general public or politicians need to pick an age for medical care that doesn’t involve them and doesn’t harm anyone?

                  • jerakor@startrek.website
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                    19 minutes ago

                    Because I don’t think a 2 year old should be given Adderall without a parent knowing?

                    I personally am pretty open minded about these things, I was able to get birth control with my partner when I was 15 without her Catholic parents knowing. That was very important, but I recognize that if we were 10 it maybe becomes a different conversation involving parents.

                    You might say a parent could be included but you also have cases of divorced parents where one parent is for and another is against and there is a question of if the childs opinions are theirs or their parents. What age should the child be able to make the call? 15? 10? 5?

            • snooggums@piefed.world
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              1 hour ago

              Framing ‘medical decisions should be left to patients and medical professionals’ as a purity test is pretty ridiculous. That is like saying ‘people shouldn’t abuse children’ is a purity test.

      • apopcorn@piefed.ca
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        6 hours ago

        I need the right to take hormones, but I dont need the right to take my dick to the ladiesz bathroom. Does this make me a Nazi?

    • themeatbridge@lemmy.world
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      6 hours ago

      There are thick, uncrossable lines, and there are a lot of people who don’t mind crossing them. You cannot compromise with a bigot. You cannot find common ground with a person who would subjugate you, or someone who sees you as less than human.

      We can have disagreements about many political issues, but when you are standing next to pedophiles, rapists, fascists, and bigots, you shouldn’t be surprised to be called a Nazi.

      So the question becomes, what is the test of “purity”?

      • powerstruggle@sh.itjust.works
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        5 hours ago

        You cannot compromise with a bigot

        To reiterate the comment you’re responding to, you’re reducing a complex world to a binary choice. Everyone that has ever existed is bigoted to some degree, therefore no compromise is possible ever?

        • themeatbridge@lemmy.world
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          3 hours ago

          Bull, and I cannot emphasize this enough, shit. Everyone is not a little bit bigoted. That’s something bigots tell themselves when rationalizing their own prejudices. You should probably take a hard look in the mirror and ask yourself if you’re the problem.

        • MotoAsh@piefed.social
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          4 hours ago

          Their example of bigots was racists and nazis plus pedos (which isn’t bigotry but universally frowned upon). They did NOT say, “any and all bigots, even of minor things”.

          Why are you trying to make them say something they did not say?

          You are part of the problem. When someone says, “I like pancakes”, what they SPECIFICALLY DID NOT SAY is, “I hate waffles”.

          Similarly, when someone says, “you cannot compromize with nazis and bigots”, what they DID NOT say was, “any concervative deserves the death penalty”. Why do you read it as such?

          • powerstruggle@sh.itjust.works
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            4 hours ago

            I quoted an entire sentence exactly. They didn’t say “I like pancakes”, they said “You can’t compromise with waffle-eaters”

            • MotoAsh@piefed.social
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              3 hours ago

              English must be so hard for you when you utterly fail to understand how assumptions work. Good job being a piece of shit contributing to the problem you’re attempting to be above.